Ep67. Dinesh Maheshwari and Joanna Peña-Bickley: A.I. & Human Flourishing

Ep67. A.I. & Human Flourishing: How Do We Get Back to Human Beings vs Humans Doing? A.I. Luminaries Dinesh Maheshwari and Guest Co-Host Joanna Peña-Bickley Weigh In

How do we get back to human beings and not just humans doing?

Today we have a special episode for you with two A.I. luminaries, guest Dinesh Maheshwari and guest co-host Joanna Peña-Bickley, who explore what it means to be human in the age of artificial intelligence.

This interview is the show’s first-ever live recorded episode brought to you in partnership with Joanna’s Ai Design Corps™! Dinesh zoomed in, and for our conversation in front of a live audience at the most recent Future Frequencies Salon. These quarterly salons are designed to inspire resilience with A.I. among the intimate group of participants at Joanna’s design lab, Aurora 21, against the backdrop of the beautiful Hudson Valley just outside of New York City.

Dinesh is a humanist entrepreneur, advisor to several startups, and Chief Technology Advisor at Groq. With a career spanning 9 startups, 3 of which he co-founded, Dinesh brings three decades of experience to the machine-learning space. He was part of the revolution in multi-threaded multi-processor high performance computing systems in the mid-‘80s; was at the forefront of the software revolution in electronic design automation from the late ‘80s to mid-‘90s; and was part of the revolution in optical communications and networking from the late ‘90s to early 2000s. He has served on the Board of Advisors for several startups and Board of Directors of industry organizations. He’s also been awarded 58 US patents with 23 additional patents pending.

Joanna, who was featured on Creativity Squared Episode 4, is the Founder & CEO of Vibes AI, an A.I.-first wearable company prioritizing brain vitality. She’s also the Founder of Ai Design Corps™, a non-profit on a mission to embed resilience into the future of learning and work with infinite diversity in infinite combinations through publishing open-source A.I. literacy resources and hosting webinars and bootcamps all over the world. Known as one of Alexa’s moms and the “Mother of Cognitive Experience Design,” Joanna integrates psychology, human-computer interaction (HCI), and design to enhance human cognition. For over 25 years, she’s launched visionary A.I. products for Amazon, AWS, Uber, GM, Citibank, and IBM, garnering patents and global acclaim featured in Time, Forbes, Fortune, TechCrunch, and The Wall Street Journal.

In today’s conversation, you’ll hear:

• Dinesh’s vision as a “humanist entrepreneur”. 
• How Dinesh distinguishes between human and machine intelligence and the differences and importance of insight and intuition-based learning as compared to path-based learning. 
• What A.I. inference is, and why it’s important.
• His perspective on the four levels of human existence, and we also explore the need for the humanities and the potential for meaningful human interactions in commercial spaces. 

Discover Dinesh’s thoughts on how A.I. can unlock new value creation and free us from, in his own words, “productivity enslavement.” You won’t want to miss his and Joanna’s passionate belief in embracing our human potential in the age of A.I.!

Humanist Entrepreneur in the World of Machine Intelligence

Dinesh’s approach to entrepreneurship is deeply rooted in his humanist principles. He seeks to work on projects that empower individuals, enabling them to shape market spaces and governing bodies, rather than being controlled by them. His focus isn’t on any particular field of technology or product, but rather on enabling value for society as a whole.

This philosophy has guided his work across various fields, from high-performance computing to education systems.

“I like to work with startups that enable value, societal value for commercially viable solutions that can be deployed at large scope and large scale, so that it doesn’t leave any human behind.”

Dinesh Maheshwari

This humanist approach extends to his view of education and individual empowerment. Dinesh emphasizes the importance of evolving education systems and distributing technology in ways that empower individuals. He believes that this empowerment is fundamental to creating the right governing bodies and market spaces, rather than allowing these structures to control individuals.

Intuition: The Secret Ingredient of Human Intelligence

One of the most striking aspects of Dinesh’s perspective is his clear distinction between human and machine intelligence. While artificial intelligence, particularly in the form of large language models, has made impressive strides, Dinesh argues that it fundamentally differs from human cognition in a crucial way. 

“Artificial general intelligence can beat human beings’ intelligence only if we reduce human intelligence to that of the machines. And the reason for that, I believe, is fundamentally how human learning is different from machine learning as being practiced today.”

Dinesh Maheshwari

Human learning, according to Dinesh, can be categorized into two types: path-based (or associative) learning and insight-based (or intuitive) learning. Current machine learning techniques excel at path-based learning, which involves analyzing patterns and making associations. However, they fall short when it comes to insight-based learning – the kind of instantaneous, breakthrough thinking that has led to humanity’s greatest discoveries.

Dinesh illustrates this point by referencing historical figures like Archimedes, Darwin, and Einstein, whose insights expanded our understanding of the world in ways that couldn’t be achieved through incremental, path-based learning alone. This unique human capability, Dinesh argues, is what truly sets us apart from machines and what we should strive to nurture and develop.

Four Levels of Human Existence

To further explore what it means to be human, Dinesh outlines four levels of human existence:

1. Sensory Level: This is the most basic level, where we simply react to sensory inputs without deeper consideration.
2. Existential Level: At this level, we consider our essential needs and act in ways that ensure our survival and well-being.
3. Doing Level: This is where most of our current societal interactions occur. We engage in commerce, establish our value to others, and focus on productivity and achievement.
4. Being Level: The highest level, where we truly connect with ourselves and others, thinking and feeling deeply and meaningfully.

Dinesh argues that while our society primarily operates at the “doing” level, true fulfillment comes from the “being” level. The challenge lies in creating structures that allow us to spend more time in this state of meaningful existence.

Challenges of Inference in A.I.

While much emphasis has been placed on training A.I. models, Dinesh argues that inference – the use of trained models to perform tasks or answer queries – is where the real challenge and potential lie.

“Inference is not only the bigger compute problem…it is a more difficult problem to solve,” Dinesh explains. He points out that inference needs to be done at the lowest cost possible, with the lowest power consumption, and at the lowest latency. These constraints make inference a particularly challenging aspect of A.I. development.

Opportunities for Improving Quality of Life

Dinesh sees artificial intelligence as a powerful tool that could potentially free us from what he terms “productivity enslavement” – a state where we’re constantly driven to do more, often at the cost of our well-being and meaningful human connections. This is illustrated with an anecdote about washing machines: while they were supposed to free up time for leisure, they instead led to higher expectations of cleanliness and, ultimately, more work.

“This transition to machine learning is another opportunity wherein we enable focus on improving the quality of life and not just improving productivity, as we have done in the past transitions.”

Dinesh Maheshwari

However, Dinesh envisions a future where A.I. takes on more of the mundane workload, allowing us to invest more time in enjoyable, meaningful interactions. This shift could transform our daily experiences, making them more fulfilling and truly human.

Joanna Pena-Bickley adds to this perspective, highlighting a shift in economic thinking from “the age of progress to the age of resilience.” She emphasizes the need to move from valuing efficiency to adaptivity, from productivity to regenerativity, and from growth at all costs to flourishing.

Importance of Humanities and Meaningful Human Interactions

One area where Dinesh sees significant potential for improvement is in our commercial interactions. He points out that most of our time is spent in commercial spaces where human interactions are highly regimented and often devoid of meaningful connection. He uses the example of getting a manicure or pedicure – while the service itself might be high-quality, the human interaction is often secondary and limited.

Dinesh argues for the importance of structuring commercial enterprises in a way that values quality human interactions. He suggests that this shift could allow us to feel more alive and human in our day-to-day lives, rather than limiting meaningful interactions to a few hours with friends and family on weekends.

One of the keys to making this pivot toward more fulfilling interactions is making sure that we are focusing on the correct problems. Dinesh says that’s where the humanities come in. Disciplines like sociology, psychology, and liberal arts produce the narratives that identify the problems that are most pressing for our quality of human life. Once the problems are identified, they can be quantified in terms of math and science, so technology solutions can be developed.  

Freeing Ourselves from “Productivity Enslavement”

Dinesh advocates for using machine learning tools to improve how we do things, allowing us to reclaim our time for more meaningful pursuits. He sees this as an opportunity to deliver us from the productivity enslavement that dominates our society. 

“Emphasis on education, wherein every individual is exposed to what we call liberal arts, I believe, is required going forward for us human beings to not fall in that trap that, unfortunately, we have been in the past few centuries of optimizing largely in one dimension, that is  productivity, that has improved a quality of existence, but not necessarily quality of life.”

Dinesh Maheshwari

This perspective aligns with Joanna’s point about moving from consumerism to eco-stewardship, and from measuring success solely by GDP to considering quality of life indicators. As Joanna puts it, “We tend to measure what we value,” suggesting that a shift in what we measure could lead to a shift in what we prioritize as a society.

Embracing Human Potential

Both Dinesh and Joanna share a passionate belief in embracing our human potential. Dinesh emphasizes that while machine learning is a powerful tool, it “doesn’t come anywhere close to what human potential is.” He encourages us to see this moment as an opportunity to “be human beings again,” using A.I. tools to free ourselves from productivity-focused constraints and explore the full range of human experience and capability.

Joanna echoes this sentiment, framing it as a move from “the idea of efficiency to adaptivity, productivity to regenerativity.” She sees this shift as part of a larger transformation, not just in technology but in our economic underpinnings and societal values.

Conclusion

As we navigate this era of rapid technological advancement, Dinesh’s and Joanna’s insights offer a compelling vision for our future. They remind us that while machine learning is a powerful tool, it doesn’t come close to the full potential of human capabilities. The challenge – and the opportunity – lies in using these tools to free ourselves from productivity enslavement and rediscover what it truly means to be human.

“It is the time for us to be human beings again that is upon us, where we can use the machine learning tools to make it happen.”

Dinesh Maheshwari

As we move forward, let’s embrace this opportunity to redefine progress, prioritize meaningful connections, and create a world that values being as much as doing.

Joanna adds a final thought, encouraging us to move “from the idea of growth, growth, growth at all cost, to flourishing.” This shift in perspective invites us to consider not just individual empowerment, but also how we can flourish in community with others.

As we stand at a pivotal moment in human history, we have the chance to shape a future that honors the full spectrum of human experience. By leveraging the power of A.I. while staying true to our uniquely human qualities of insight, creativity, and meaningful connection, we may just unlock the full potential of both our technological innovations and our shared humanity.

Links Mentioned in this Podcast

• AI Design Corps™
• Future Frequencies Salon All-Female Panel on A.I. – Transcript
• Aurora 21
• Groq
• Podcast: Episode 4 – Joanna Peña-Bickley: Daring to Design a Better Future
• Vibes AI

Continue the Conversation

Thank you, Dinesh and Joanna, for joining us on this special episode of Creativity Squared. 

This show is produced and made possible by the team at PLAY Audio Agency: https://playaudioagency.com.  

Creativity Squared is brought to you by Sociality Squared, a social media agency who understands the magic of bringing people together around what they value and love: http://socialitysquared.com.

Because it’s important to support artists, 10% of all revenue Creativity Squared generates will go to ArtsWave, a nationally recognized non-profit that supports over 150 arts organizations, projects, and independent artists.

Join Creativity Squared’s free weekly newsletter and become a premium supporter here.