TRANSCRIPT

King Willonius: You got this, you got this, man, like, honestly, like, you know, this year has been such an amazing year, and it’s, I feel like the success that I’ve had, I feel like everybody could have that, you know, it’s just, like, you just believe, or know that you can have it. And then, um, but, yeah, I tell people all that all the time, like, that’s been my thing. I’m like, You got this, like, just believe and work from the that point of, like, your belief, you know, I’m saying, like, just, like, put yourself in that space and then just do the damn thing and and things just, kind of, it’s like, life’s like water, it just, it moves out the way, and it does what it needs to.

Helen: Welcome to Creativity Squared. Discover how creatives are collaborating with artificial intelligence in your inbox, on YouTube, and on your preferred podcast platform. Hi, I’m Helen Todd, your host, and I’m so excited to have you join the weekly conversations I’m having with amazing pioneers in this space.

Helen: The intention of these conversations is to ignite our collective imagination at the intersection of AI and creativity to envision a world where artists thrive.

Helen: Well, hello, Creativity Squared is in Miami during Art Basel, and I am so excited because we’re at the FilmGate interactive immersive festival for its 11th edition. It’s one of the top immersive festivals in the entire world, and we have the executive director with us today, Diliana Alexander, so congratulations on an amazing festival, and I would love to for you to share with our audience what makes FilmGate and this festival so special,

Diliana: Of course. Thank you so much, and thank you for having me on the podcast. I have now become a big fan. So what makes it special for us is, first that we introduce immersive and interactive projects to the Miami audience and the audience at large, since it happens during Miami Art week, Art Basel, also that we bring the top talent in immersive spaces, the most interesting and exciting technologies of the year that have been kind of accumulated into the projects, and also government agencies and funds that are interested in supporting them, with our goal being that projects are funded here, but also they they meet each other, and then maybe new collaborations get formed. And every single person that comes to the festival is so exciting. You learn from them and get inspired. So for us, this is really, really special.

Helen: I’ve seen the collaborations happening in real time, and it’s so exciting. And I love it’s a it’s an intimate space. So you really can make connections and see people. So it’s, it is very special, if you can make it next year. And of course, as you guys know I interviewed Will, and next year, he’ll be debuting the full version of BBL Drizzy. But walk us through what all is encompassed in the festival, because it’s five days and you do a lot. So tell us about the festival experience here in Miami.

Diliana: First, we always start — now that are in our 11th edition, we figured we’d experiment, but we also have certain things that are tradition. So we always start our opening night at the Frost Science Museum Planetarium. They’re an incredible partner. They have allowed us to bring artistic projects into a science space, which is super, super cool, and we program dome experiences, or planetarium experiences from around the world. But also this year, we did a teaser of King Willonius’s BBL Drizzy musical dome experience, knowing that this is going to be the first artistic Miami dome experience, and FilmGate is behind it too, so we will be supporting it with resources, variety of resources and funding, and then we always finish in a very Miami style. So award ceremony happens on a sunset cruise. So it’s incredible to have everybody happy they have accomplished what they wanted to do, presented their projects, and then they kind of are trapped on the boat for four hours and cement those friendships. So yes, it’s a very intimate experience, but quality over quantity, and everybody becomes fast friends.

Helen: I love it. I missed the memo on the scheduling, because this happened kind of fast, but next year I will be on that cruise for sure, and Okay, so tell us — you’ve got the planetarium, the market. What are the actual activities around Miami, too that you guys have here?

Diliana: Absolutely we have this year. We limited the amount of experiences, so we focused on 10 complete immersive experiences.  We w anted more people to see them, and we wanted to be really highly selective, so some of the projects are premiers, and then some of the projects are actually winners of South by Southwest. So Venice, so these are as a head curator, these are the top my favorite projects that are brought here. And this year’s also really exciting, because I think 80% of the projects are female driven, so by female directors. I didn’t mean it to be that way, but maybe it’s because of our theme of rewilding and reconnecting the human spirit back to nature. It’s I love that women are creating in that space. We also, for the first year ever, we are launching North America’s first market. It’s actually happening right now, immersive market, so 15 projects from around the world are pitching at the market to funds, to collaborators, to cultural institutions, especially Miami ones, hoping that these projects we will at some point support, to have them in their full experience here but anywhere else in the world and and then we, for the first time ever, also launched an AI experimentation with seven artists, and we created a public installation that’s happening in this building. So it’s outside, it’s an LED screen that wraps the building so everybody in Miami can actually experience it. We want more public art and more public immersive art. It’s really difficult. It’s very expensive, so we actually got to play on this amazing building. And that was really thoughtful of the Paramount at the Miami World Center to let us do that.

Helen: I’ve been really impressed with really everything, the content, the people, the talent and the art works. And another thing is how conscientious you are of involving the First Peoples and the content and making sure not only their perspective, but we’re seeing their art and their narrative and even push back on the theme itself. So can you tell us a little bit about how you came to the theme and the intentionality behind the people in the room too? 

Diliana: I thought that was fantastic that our keynote speaker, William Osceola, who was representing the Miccosukee Tribe of Indians, and he’s an elected official for them, push back on the theme of rewilding, saying, well, that that could be problematic because…and these are the kind of conversations that we want to encourage. And I think that’s what a curator really wants is to place a theme and to create conversations around them, and not just praise around them, but really meaningful and deep conversations. We started working with the Canadian government, and then also our local partners, the Miccosukees and filmmakers that we work in the Miccosukee Tribe of Indians, because we wanted to bring First People creators first so indigenous, First Nations, First People, including also Innu to bring them to Miami and to introduce them to creators from the tribes here, we want to be just empowerers. We probably mess up. We definitely don’t want it to be a tokenization, but we do hope that creative projects emerge, and more of these conversations and a point of view it’s being brought to the to to the festival and to different creators.

Helen: I know I learned a lot, and I really appreciate that programming. So tell us, how did you get connected with Will, or King Willonius. How did that come to be? Because he talks about a lot of the interview was about manifesting. So how did this happen, where he ended up at the festival in a dream space of doing a planetarium work? So can you share that story with us?

Diliana: So Will is our one of kind of like an ideal creator. This is what we want to do with a lot of the traditional filmmakers actually in South Florida, we represent them as an organization. So South Florida is very much focused on traditional film, we call it flat east and immersive. But Will started as a traditional filmmaker, and he’s also a comedian, and then he he dove into technology, especially during the pandemic, and started playing with AI. So we’ve been watching him, as a FilmGate member, go from making a short film, a pilot for TV show, and now creating immersive experiences and blowing up. So we are huge fans, obviously. Also he’s he’s been in kind of in the family for maybe now 10 years. So when we found out that about what he we invited him to speak to AI about AI and creativity at planetarium, one of our planetarium events. And then we said, “Well, do you want to do a dome experience?” Because this would be an incredible — first it’s Miami, second it’s deep because it engages a lot of conversations around hip hop, but it’s also viral, because it’s the, you know, it’s the Drake versus Kendrick Lamar controversy. And it’s also utilizing Generative AI and what’s happening now by a really smart, beautiful creator. So, so all of it kind of aligned.

Helen: I love that. And this, this festival, reflects and embraces so much innovation and the boundary-pushing and everyone’s learning from each other. Like one of the immersive panels earlier was like the panels on stage were learning from the other experiment. So that was really special. So if you want the audience to remember one thing about the festival, what would that one thing be about the festival that you’d like them to walk away with?

Diliana: Oh, that anybody can be a creator with especially the democratization of technology that’s happening right now, you can come and explore it, and you can meet a lot of people that you can collaborate with and learn from. So don’t just experience but also create. I think creativity would be one of the points that saves the humanity, I feel, because we are on this verge of will we continue existing as we are or at all, and that’s a dark conversation that we also kind of put into, weaved into the festival. We sugar coated it a lot with a lot of fun, and hopefully that was a message that was taken away as well. So, yes, come and create with us and play. Come play with us.

Helen: I’m playing in the playground of possibility. Come play. It’s in Miami. Have fun. So thank you so much for having us here. It’s such an honor. And this is my first time at FilmGate, and it definitely will not be my last time. So thank you, Diliana. 

Diliana: I can’t wait to have you back and come create with us in the playground of possibilities.

Helen: Welcome to Creativity Squared. Discover how creatives are collaborating with artificial intelligence in your inbox, on YouTube and on your preferred podcast platform? Hi, I’m Helen Todd, your host, and I’m so excited to have you join the weekly conversations I’m having with amazing pioneers in the space. The intention of these conversations is to ignite our collective imagination at the intersection of AI and creativity, to envision a world where artists thrive. You just a dream. So this is a live podcast recording for Creativity Squared, which is a podcast that explores the intersection of AI and creativity. My name is Helen Todd. I’m the founder and host, and I couldn’t be more excited to introduce my guest today, King Willonius, welcome to Creativity Squared. And I also just want to say a big thank you to Diliana Alexander, the co founder and executive producer and the entire team at the FilmGate Miami Interactive Festival for this amazing content, speakers, and just for having us be here today. So we have a short session, so we’re gonna dive right in. But, Will, this has been an amazing year for you. One of your AI created songs. BBL Drizzy went viral. You made the TIME100 AI 2024 list, and here, at one of the top 10 immersive film festivals in the world, gave us a sneak peek of a musical of the same name of BBL Drizzy. So I kind of want this to be a time capsule of this moment in time right now. You’re not the only guest on my show where AI has changed the trajectory of their career. So how are you feeling right now, in this moment in time?

Willonius: Ecstatic, you know, this has been, like I said, like, an amazing year. So much has happened, yeah, just, just very grateful, you know, very grateful and thankful for all the experiences that I’ve had this year.

Helen: One thing I definitely want to talk about is manifesting, because in a lot of ways, this is why I’m here today, too. But let’s start from August of 2023 also your birthday. Where did this crazy adventure begin? And we’re starting the domino at Burning Man. So tell us the story.

Willonius: Yeah, um, you know, as we talk like back forth, I felt like Burning Man was like a big start of everything that kind of happened. I was at Burning Man the year that the mud flood, or whatever, it rained. And for me, it was just such a very magical experience. I was very grateful to be out there, like, after it rained, it was like a huge double rainbow that appeared over the Playa. But, yeah, I always say that, like, I don’t know if my year would have went the way it went had I not been to Burning Man, just because being out there felt so magical. So I felt like I understood what magic felt like. So, you know, as things were kind of manifesting this year, there are a lot of times where I was like, “Oh, this feels like that Burning Man magic” or energy that that happens out there that only you know. Most people that experience it, they kind of know about it, but if you don’t really go out there, you might not know what that feels like. I don’t know maybe you do outside of it, but I definitely know that there’s like a there’s like this — people that go there, they just, they know that that magic is, you know, so, yeah, and then things have just been, it’s like, every month, something really interesting or cool happens. And I don’t know how to explain it, it just, it just happens, you know, like, you know, a lot of these things happened without, like, management, or, you know, me trying to run ads and just, you know, things constantly going viral. And I just feel very blessed.

Helen: Tell me about how you think about vibration, because that came up when we first met.

Willonius: Okay, so this is like a thought that I’ve been playing with that I I kind of, I don’t know it’s just something I assume. So I feel like when you — you have to raise yourself to like a certain vibration or frequency, however you want to call it, in order to like just be, I guess, seen. Like, if you’re not vibrating on a certain level, and then people that are on that level just don’t even see you. So whether it be like, Okay, I’m a I’m an artist, or I’m, you know, I go to the gym or whatever it is like, but you have to essentially raise your vibration, and you do that through just like, constant action — action, and then, like, you know, belief and whatnot, but the belief comes from just you seeing what you want and then knowing that it’s possible, and then you act on that thing. And then two things too is just like, I feel like there’s two sides of it, so like there’s belief and then there’s knowing. So I think that when you act. Or you are in this space of, like, knowing, that’s when things really manifest. Because, like, beliefs can be changed, right? Where, like, tomorrow, I believe it might be cold, or I believe it could rain, we don’t know, but I know that the sun’s going to come up. I know that at a certain point it’s going to get dark. So like, I feel like that’s like the big shift that happened for me in this, you know, this past year,

Helen: And that was Burning Man that kicked off that shift?

Willonius: You know, it Burning Man was like, a checkpoint, you know, so, like, like a video game, it’s just like, that was like, once I you reach that checkpoint, you don’t go past back, you know, before you reach that checkpoint.

Helen: I know that there was a session here at the FilmGate festival that was talking about immersive experiences and what that definition means, and really Burning Man is probably the most amazing immersive experience. For me, it was like as close to be on another planet as I can ever, ever be. But this is about you today, um, so you’ve come really close before, having like a breakout before, and so Burning Man happened, it sent you on this new trajectory. And then BBL Drizzy happened. So tell us the story. And for those who might not know what BBL and what Drizzy and what the Kendrick whole thing is fill us all in and tell us the story.

Willonius: Yeah. So, a BBL is just a Brazilian Butt Lift. I mean, they’re really popular here in Miami. Think a lot of people know about that. I didn’t, okay, yeah, yeah. So, and then, you know, the song came about because of this Drake Kendrick beef that happened. Rick Ross and Drake were kind of going at it. And then Rick Ross said that Drake has like, fake abs, and he started calling him BBL Drizzy. So it was trending one day on Twitter, and then I made a song about it, and it just went viral, you know, and for like, two days, and then like, two weeks later, it went viral again, which doesn’t really happen a lot of times when things go viral, you know, so like, but the second time it went viral, it went like, mega viral, to the point where it was everywhere. People, people literally have gotten married to this song, BBL Drizzy, which is insane for like, somebody to get married to a comedy song. But, you know, I think that’s one of the things when, when we kind of like, as we talk about, like, manifesting, like, you don’t really know how big a thing can get, you know. So what I’m kind of like learning throughout the process is like you just you, you kind of get married to, like a feeling, and then the feeling is, for me, it’s just like gratitude, and you just being very grateful. And then everything else, your reality kind of shapes and and, I guess, morph to like, be in alignment to like how you feel, well.

Helen: And one thing — so how we got connected was through, shout out to Dustin Califf, who runs Tool, and they do really innovative AI stuff, and work with AI artists. And one of the things that he said is that you’re really good about tapping into cultural moments, right? And give us an idea of how fast you made this song and how you made the song with AI.

Willonius: So yeah, I made this, I wrote all the lyrics, and I used AI to, kind of, like create the sound that I wanted. So like prompting the specific sound, which is like, like a Motown type sound. Everything took me about, I want to say maybe 20, 30 minutes in essence. So, like I had to write the song. I wrote the song really fast, and then prompted it, and then created the AI image that is like the cover art, because I wanted it to look like it was made in the 70s. And then I put it together in Adobe Premiere so I can, like, just have a song and everything playing and then export it and upload it. So, like, that whole process, I want to say about about 30 minutes, like the whole thing.

Helen: I love that, and 30 minutes changed the trajectory of your career.

Willonius: Yeah. Well, you know, it’s just like, I find that, like, I’ve listened to like artists sometimes where they talk about, like, you know, they their breakout song is something that was like an accident or, you know, they didn’t — I think when you when you’re operating like that, you don’t have time, like, overthink. And a lot of times when you’re creating, whether it be like, I write scripts and whatnot, like, what stops a lot of writers or creators is like that, that editor brain. So it’s like, you have two brains. One, it’s just, like the creative which is just, it’s almost like a just a vomit dump, and you’re not overthinking, and the editor brain wants to, like, second guess everything. So it’s like, oh, well, maybe you should… And that stops a lot of people from just being their most true creative self. So I’ve gotten a lot better in like, muting or turning that voice down, or just not listening to it, you know, and and just trying to be just trusting my intuition more.

Helen: I love that you listen to your intuition. And the one of the interviews I listen to to prep for, this is your one with Baratunde, which I really recommend that interview. Yeah, shout out. Shout out to him. But one of the interesting things too, which I didn’t put it in the introduction for the stage, is that you’re a comedian first, and I love how prolific you are and aren’t scared to just put so many ideas out there. So walk us through how comedy has informed your story telling.

Willonius: Well, you know, with comedy, it’s just like you you have to get comfortable being uncomfortable and being comfortable failing. So, you know, when you start out being a comedian, you suck, and then you go, you keep going on stage, and then you suck less and less and less and less to the point where you actually start to get good or okay, and then you start to get good. So, but that’s just a process in in life. You know, it’s like, anytime you try something new. You’re not going to be the best at it, you know, you just, you just be, if you’re okay with saying, like, I don’t know what I’m doing, and I’m probably going to suck at this for a little while, or maybe a long time, but I’m going to keep working with the intention that I’m going to get good at it, and eventually it just everything. I feel like our brains and minds are so powerful, right? And it’s designed to figure things out. So as long as you don’t give up, you will come up on other side. So that’s why I kind of just approach everything. I’m like, I’m okay with sucking. A lot of it just played because, well, part of it was because nobody was really watching what I was doing. So that takes a lot of pressure off where it’s just, like, to, like, a lot of people, it’s just like, you know, everybody wants to be the biggest thing, but like, you have to have, like, that incubation period where you can just suck and it’s okay, you know, like, if I, if I put out something really terrible now, there might be a little bit more pressure where, you know, maybe I might get, I might disappoint a lot of people, but I still don’t care like because it’s just like, end of the day, the only person you need to impress is yourself, you know. And I’m okay with what I do, so there’s no pressure.

Helen: I love that. And tell us about BBL Drizzy and the evolution of this song, because you — It’s powered by AI, and the human side, you wrote the lyrics. The AI side you’ve collaborated for the rest. But what have you done with that song? And then it’s partly why we’re here today. But yeah, what did you do with it after it went viral?

Willonius: So one, I made like 100 different versions of it. So because I have like a BBL Drizzy, this is Motown version, but I have, like, a gospel, yacht rock, K, pop, like, you name it. I just was trying to explore as much as I can. But, like, my background was, was always comedy and writing, so a lot of people just know me now. They’re like, Oh, you’re a producer, or you’re just this AI guy. And I was like, I only got into AI because of the writer strike. Like, had the writer strike not happen, I would have still been trying to break into the industry as a writer.

Helen: Can you tell the audience what you said on our pre call? Of, like, how you made that decision?

Willonius: Yeah, yeah. I was, I was, I was going back and forth whether or not because, you know, the writer strike was partly because of AI and and I was, I was really apprehensive. I was like, I don’t want to get blackballed by the WGA, by leaning into AI and I’ll never be able to work. And then I sat there in my room one day and I was like, Well, let me count all the checks that I’ve got from the WGA, and it was zero. So I was like, You know what? I don’t have anything to lose. So a lot of times it’s just leaning into, like, not having anything to lose and like, you know, end of the day is, I think we live this life to be our best selves and experiment, you know. I’m saying like, if you if you’re trying to play life safe, then I don’t think you can fully experience life, you know. So you gotta go to places that you never been before, be in uncomfortable situations, because that’s where the real growth is. So, so, yeah, so I was just like, alright, well, we got BBL Drizzy. I want to show people that I can write. So I was like, Let’s do BBL Drizzy The Musical. And I started writing it as a audio drama. And then I was talking to Diliana and Jocko, and they were like, you could do it as a planetarium experience. And I was like, what? And that kind of goes back to the whole manifest thing, because I’ve been wanting to do a planetarium experience for years, like I used to go to the Frost Museum and watch their Laser shows. And I was like, Man, I would just love to, one day just be able to do something in there. And then it kind of happened this year, you know. So again, that whole Burning Man magic was just around me. So, like, a part of it too is just like asking for the things that you want, you know, like, sometimes we don’t do that. So, so yeah, so then BBL Drizzy Musical came. I wrote the script. It’s like 45 pages. And then, and yeah, and then next, we’ll, next year we’ll be debuting it.

Helen: So how we connected was through Dustin, like I said, I was like, Oh, he sounds really interesting. Will you connect me? Yeah, to bring on the show. And we hopped on Zoom, and we hit it off really quickly. And I was like, you know, I’ve been wanting to go Miami. I have a crazy idea, why don’t we do this podcast? Like, I love it. I was like, Really, and because I’ve been wanting to go. And then we hopped on the call with Diliana, and she’s like, Yes, come. So I feel like in a lot of ways, us meeting here today has been manifested, right?

Willonius: You know? I just think and this, I believe this very strongly. I think we, we live in a very magical place Earth. Whatever you want to call this place is very magical. But a lot of times it’s just like we just have to, almost like a radio dial, just like fine tune, or tune ourselves into whatever type of alignment so that this magic can happen. But what happens is we either get distracted, or we allow our fears to not let the thing that wants, that we want to come towards us. You know, so like again, like me for the planetarium just like asking, had I been fearful, I would have maybe not said anything, you know, like, oh, I can’t ask them, but, and they’ve done that. The FilmGate has done that for me throughout pretty much my whole career. Like my first short film that I made, I just asked him one day, I was like, Yo, I need a RED camera. And it was like, we got one for you. And I was like, what? So then we did another film. So a lot of times it’s really just being comfortable, just asking for what you want, the playa provides, the Playa provides, right? The Playa provides. That’s something we learned at Burning Man.

Helen: So tell us, since we got a sneak peek about the inspiration for the story line of the musical version, how much of it was influenced by your experience this year, kind of breaking out, having your big breakout moment. Or, yeah, give us a little bit more for the

Willonius: This is based off of Dune. Like I watched Dune 27 times, Dune Two, and I just wanted to make something that was like inspired by that and the whole Drake Kendrick. So it’s literally like Dune meets Hip Hop Drake and Kendrick beef. So, so everything, if you watch Dune, it’s literally that, you know, so, like, spice kind of rules the world of Dune. In my short it’s, it’s ruled by clout. So it’s just like the Social Media Creator has to get clout in order to save the world and he becomes a BBL Drizzy.

Helen: I did not know that, I’m a huge fan of Denis Villeneuve so I’m even more excited.. Okay, so we’re short on time, and I want to make sure I get some of my questions. I had a gal, Shira Lazar on my show. She does “What’s Trending,” another great creator economy content that she does and the future is the Creator Economy. I have a whole book that I’m writing next year called “Farewell to the Information Age, Welcome to the Imagination Age.” But one thing that came out of that conversation is I think there’s like less than 10% it might be less than 5% of the creators make over $100,000 a year. So if this is the future, and everyone’s going to be a creator with all these AI tools, how where’s the opportunity to make money? So I want to hear your experience of that side, because I don’t feel like people talk about the financial side of being a creator. So can you tell us a little bit about your experience?

Willonius: Yeah, I’ve been able to kind of just monetize and make money from the things that I’ve created. But I think we were talking about this yesterday, and I always tell people, because I’ve had a lot of people come up to me and they’re like, I want to start creating. And this, my belief is just like, the more you create, the more opportunities you create for yourself. So the best thing you can do right now, because it is a creator economy, is start creating, you know, and don’t, don’t work, like, like, this past year, all I told myself when I left Burning Man, it was like, I’m gonna make an AI video every day, I mean, every week. And that’s it. That’s all I and I was like, I’m gonna stay consistent. Uh, whatever happens, happens. My birthday is 8/24, August 24, so I was like, This is my COVID year. And I was just, I’m gonna just be very process oriented. And throughout that process, what I just learned is just like, if you just stay consistent in the thing that you want to do, eventually everything will kind of come around. So I didn’t, I didn’t start trying to think, I’m gonna make money. I just was like, I’m just gonna make so create things. So like, you know, there’s a lot of platforms now. Like, you know, YouTube is a great resource for like creators to make money off of there and then, you know, either teaching things or creating products. But, you know, we, we’re in a great space now where, if you’re a creator, you can literally make a life for yourself just by using your imagination to think of things that people would enjoy.

Helen: That is a great tee up for my next question on the imagination age, because I do believe that the power of ideas will be the new currency. And I’m curious what your creative process is, or was, pre AI, and how it is now, because you have so many toys at your disposal that’s enabling you to make all these immersive and crazy world so give us a little insight of how AI has empowered your creative abilities, I guess, yeah,

Willonius: I mean, it’s just allowed me to dream way bigger. Now, you know, so, like, that’s, that’s probably the biggest thing, because I feel like my work ethic is still pretty much the same, but now you. You know, like doing an experience in the Planetarium. Like before it was just like, I don’t know how I’m gonna pull that off, but now you’re just like, Okay, we you know, you can take certain tools and then, like, you can enhance your workflows. You just become way more productive. So instead of having one person work on things, you can use the AI. It’s like almost having like five to 10 people working on the project. So, so, yes, it’s having AI just has allowed me to dream way bigger, you know, like I can, I can make any type of song that I want to make. I can make almost not all full films, but just like trailers to kind of show people and like, you know. So I just feel very, very empowered.

Helen: One thing in our conversations that really comes across in and one thing to point out, too, I kind of went through this really quick on the introduction; Will is on the TIME100 AI list this year for 2024 and he’s one of the only artists on that list. And it’s under the innovative category of innovators with AI. And you said, like you used to want to break out into Hollywood, but then with the song, you’ve got more attention from the music industry. But really, because you play in all the tools, I think you really represent the future. And like, the industries are trying to catch up to what you’re doing, because everything’s blurring together, and you are already embracing that. And even here today, like, whether it’s the opera or all these different mediums, they’re all merging together in these tools. So you, like, really understood the assignment and are playing in the playground of possibility, which I really love. And I think one thing too, that I wanted to make sure to ask you today, because of the seat that you sit in, what What is your wish list for the Sam Altman’s, the Mark Zuckerberg’s and all the builders, because we want to feel good about everything that we’re producing, and the way that a lot of these tools came into being, of being scraped with artists, doesn’t make us feel good. So what is your wish list to make this more equitable, so that we can all thrive?

Willonius:  Yeah, I think. And one to your point, too, I feel like the future is definitely fluid, you know, so, like the artist spectrum, like we’re going to be able to just kind of tap into so many different things, and where before it’s just like, you have to just be a specialist. I think these tools allow us to be, like, high level generalist, you know, where we can be like, I can do this and that different industries. But I think the biggest thing, I feel, is just like, have, making sure people have a seat at the table, right? Because, you know, if we’re, if you’re, if I’m stepping into, I don’t know construction, I need to make sure that I have people that know construction. In order to make sure I can, I can properly provide a product or a service for these individuals. So if we’re looking at artists, or we’re looking at people that you know, you’re scraping data and doing all these different things like we need to make sure that you know you have artists on the table. Make sure that, you know, people are properly compensated for their work. And, you know, I think we just need to make sure it’s a the community is is being taken care of.

Helen: And I want to talk about the the monetization part, again, because there’s, like, the YouTube views, and we’re really happy that you’re increasing the statistic I mentioned earlier. But what are the new economic opportunities that AI and even Smart Contracts and like blockchain are opening up? Because I think this audience specifically, and the creativity squared audience would be really curious, like, how do you see new economic opportunities from the seat that you set?

Willonius: Oh yeah, I think a lot of the traditional ways are still going to work, definitely, like the brand deals and whatnot. But I think the best thing to do, which I do, is jump into your favorite large language model, I love, ChatGPT, and develop your strategy of how you want to, like monetize for the next five to 10. So I did this, like a couple days ago. They everybody, much of my astrology friends, were like, Pluto is going into Aquarius or something like that. And then I was like, Okay, well, this is my bio. This is what I do. Tell me how I need to or create a strategy on how I need to monetize and and do what I need to do according to this astrological thing that’s happening. So I think for like artists would, depending on what you — like, if I’m a comedian, I’ll be like, Okay, let’s create a strategy on how I can monetize. Here’s my skill set, here’s the things that I like to do. And you know that to me, that’s not the best way to figure it out, but the traditional ways will never go away. So you know, brand deals, create products, create create ways to engage with people, because, like, right now, we’re in the Creator Economy, but it’s really, to me, it’s just an attention economy. So like, the more you can garner people’s attention, the more money you’ll probably make. You see that with the streamers, like, streamers make tons of money now just because, like, they have people watching them for 24 hours a day, so they’re just going to — Their income potential is, like unlimited. So I think that, I hope I answer that correctly. 

Helen: We were also kind of talking about the evolution of, like, fan fiction and whatnot. But I got a note that we only have three minutes, so we’ll do rapid fire for the last questions. Okay, we’re closing out. Yeah, 2024 break out year for you, looking back, if you had to top or had to pick your top experience or memory from this year, what is it and why? And looking ahead to 2025 What are you most excited about?

Willonius: I would say BBL Drizzy going viral, working on my, my comedy album, “Unserious.” That was really dope. Om’Mas Keith produced it, Who won the Grammy for Frank Ocean’s album. So I was like, How did I end up here? And then BBL Drizzy the musical like, that was like, really? Because this is, like, the the, like, the ending of the year. So it’s, like, really cool to be here with FilmGate and Art Basel. So I feel like I’ve had like, a full circle moment. Oh yeah, Burning Man. Oh my gosh. Burning Man is amazing. Jeez.

Helen: Oh you went this year too? Amazing. And then next year we’ll get back on stage and see what happens between now and the actual debut of the full musical. So what are you most excited about going into 2025?

Willonius: Just the unknown. The unknown excites me now, because it’s just like, that’s it used to be kind of scary, but now it’s just like, you don’t really know what’s gonna happen, like you just always, my quote this year has always been, like, good intentions, but no expectations. So because that’s all you can do really in life, is just like, go in with like, I’m gonna do my best, I’m gonna try my hardest. But whatever happens kind of just happens. So you know, when you don’t have expectations, you don’t get disappointed. So I just be like, alright, so yeah, I’m excited about just like, the unknown and what can potentially manifest this year.

Helen: Amazing. And I always like to ask all of my guests if you want the audience that’s live here or listening or watching online, to remember one thing, what is that one thing that you want them to walk away with?

Willonius: You got this, you got this, man, like, honestly, like, you know, this year has been such a amazing year, and it’s, I feel like the success that I’ve had, I feel like everybody could have that, you know, it’s just, like, you just believe, or know that you can have it. And then, um, but, yeah, I tell people all that all the time, like, that’s been my thing. I’m like, You got this, like, just believe and and work from the that point of, like, your belief, you know, I’m saying, like, just, like, put yourself in that space and they just do the damn thing and and things just, kind of, it’s like, life’s like water, it just, it moves out the way, and it does what it needs to do.

Helen: I think Jackie Chan has a really good quote about be like water. Well, congratulations. Thank you. I feel like you’re just scratching the surface, and the more that these tools like evolve, that your playground and your possibilities are just going to evolve too. And I’m so excited to see what you do. So thank you. Thank you to FilmGate. Thank you to Diliana. And I know we could keep talking on and on, but they have a show to do. So thank you everyone for the audience today, too. Thank you. Thank you for spending some time with us today. We’re just getting started, and would love your support, subscribe to Creativity Squared on your preferred podcast platform and leave a review. It really helps, and I’d love to hear your feedback. What topics are you thinking about and want to dive into more? I invite you to visit creativitysquared.com to let me know. And while you’re there, be sure to sign up for our free weekly newsletter so you can easily stay on top of all the latest news at the intersection of AI and creativity, because it’s so important to support artists. 10% of all revenue Creativity Squared generates will go to ArtsWave, a nationally recognized non profit that supports over 100 arts organizations. Become a premium newsletter subscriber or leave a tip on the website to support this project and ArtsWave and premium newsletter subscribers will receive an NFT of episode cover art and more extras to say, thank you for helping bring my dream to life. And a big, big thank you to everyone who’s offered their time, energy and encouragement and support so far, I really appreciate it from the bottom of my heart. This show is produced and made possible by the team at PLAY audio agency. Until next week, keep creating.