Who's In This Podcast
Helen Todd is co-founder and CEO of Sociality Squared and the human behind Creativity Squared.
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Ep47. Celebrating the 1-Year Anniversary of Creativity Squared: A.I. and the Boundless Sky of Possibility
Creativity Squared is officially one year old! It’s been an exciting and fast-paced year, both on the production of this podcast and all that has transpired on the A.I. front. Today’s episode is a special one because it will serve as a time capsule of where we’ve been, where we’re at, and where we’re going here at Creativity Squared and at the intersection of A.I. and creativity.
This episode is also a checkpoint on our journey to answer the big, hairy questions that inspired us to do this kind of podcast in the first place. We’re on an infinite quest to better understand how A.I. will change our relationships, our work, and what it means fundamentally to be human. We share expert insights on these questions from our archive of 40+ interviews with a diverse range of technical experts, researchers, executives, artists, activists, thinkers, and entrepreneurs.
If you’ve been on this journey with us since the inaugural episode featuring Harry Yeff in April 2023, then happy anniversary to you, too! Thank you for your support as we grow the Creativity Squared platform into the best source for critical conversations at the intersection of creativity and artificial intelligence.
This past year has been a whirlwind of activity, like building a plane while flying it, particularly with the rapid developments in artificial intelligence. I am profoundly grateful to everyone who has supported this venture through messages, subscriptions, or by becoming paid members. Your support fuels our passion and sustains our efforts.
I also want to acknowledge the incredible team behind the scenes at Creativity Squared. Special thanks to Edward, Dan, Megan, and the team at Play Audio Agency, who are instrumental in bringing this podcast to life.
One ah-ha moment for launching this show happened on stage at South by Southwest (SXSW) 2023. Greg Brockman, co-founder of OpenA.I., was pressed by the moderator on ethical considerations around A.I., particularly about artists’ attribution. His response — that the developers themselves don’t have all the answers and that it’s crucial for society to engage in shaping the use of these tools. This comment underscored how we need to have community-wide dialogues about the future we wish to build with A.I., emphasizing a human-centered approach where A.I. amplifies the best of human potential, not replace us.
This show aims to be a proactive platform for these conversations, envisioning a future where artists and creators not only coexist with A.I. but thrive. Creativity Squared explores the intersection of A.I. and creativity, engaging artists, creators, and the intellectually curious. As we celebrate our first anniversary, we’re only beginning to scratch the surface of what’s possible.
To our Creativity Squared community, I know time is our most valuable resource and we appreciate the time you spend with us. My commitment to you is to make every episode worthwhile by bringing you the critical conversations that will help us navigate the evolving landscape of A.I. together. Here’s to exploring, learning, and shaping a future that enhances our collective human experience.
As we like to say on the show, “You never know what ripples will turn into waves.” One conversation can make all the difference.
Managing Anxieties and Aspirations About A.I. Through Understanding
Imagining the future of A.I. can be scary. It’s a natural human reaction to fear the unknown, especially with technology as transformative as artificial intelligence, which is already integrated into every facet of our daily lives. From Google search results to social network algorithms and voice assistants like Siri, A.I.’s influence is pervasive. The launch of OpenAI’s ChatGPT has further democratized A.I., making it accessible through natural language interaction and highlighting its implications for better and worse.
As we navigate this new era, it’s crucial to address the valid concerns surrounding A.I.. This show aims to be a safe space for exploring these concerns, whether you’re just beginning to engage with A.I. or you’ve fully embraced its potential. But as we’ve seen with previous technologies such as social media, the rapid adoption of A.I. comes with risks. Issues like polarization, the loneliness epidemic, and depression among teens illustrate the potential for greater societal impacts.
The night before launching this podcast, I watched The AI Dilemma, a sobering presentation by Tristan Harris and Aza Raskin from the Center for Humane Technology, the same duo that created “The Social Dilemma” for Netflix. They likened themselves to messengers from the future, warning us of the need to slow down A.I.’s unchecked proliferation and to implement meaningful regulations. Their presentation suggests we adopt a position of cautious optimism and proactive regulation to avoid repeating past mistakes.
“A.I. may help us achieve major advances like curing cancer or addressing climate change. But the point we’re making is: if our dystopia is bad enough, it won’t matter how good the utopia we want to create is. We only get one shot, and we need to move at the speed of getting it right.” – “The A.I. Dilemma”
This dialogue is vital as we consider A.I.’s role not just in enhancing our lives but also in shaping the fabric of society. By critically examining A.I.’s impact and potential, we aim to harness its benefits while mitigating its risks. This show is committed to fostering a deep, informed conversation about how A.I. can serve humanity positively without exacerbating existing challenges.
We’ve welcomed guests from both sides of the A.I. divide, but almost everyone holds at least some optimism for what A.I. will offer us, even those who could stand to lose more than most of us. In episode 10, for instance, photographer Thomas Boenig discussed how text-to-image generators might make it harder for photographers to find work while acknowledging that A.I. could offer benefits to society that outweigh the consequences to his career.
“I’d hate to see the craft slowly fade away and be replaced by computers. But [A.I.] will have so many positive impacts on our lives that maybe we can sacrifice photography for the sake of humanity. Being able to cure cancer, I’m totally fine with that if that’s the result.” – Thomas Boenig
Curing cancer might sound like hyperbole, but A.I.’s capabilities are vast and growing. For example, Google’s DeepMind A.I. lab rocked the scientific world in 2020 by cracking the code to understand protein structures, unlocking infinite possibilities for combating disease and improving the food supply. In my hometown of Cincinnati, Dr. Kelly Cohen is using A.I. innovatively in healthcare to diagnose coronary artery disease during regular mammograms to improve early detection.
At a recent MIT A.I. summit, I also learned about A.I.’s potential to revolutionize modern medicine by moving beyond traditional pharmaceuticals to more targeted molecular solutions that could fundamentally alter how we treat diseases.
In this rapidly evolving era of scientific innovation, we stand on the precipice of significant progress. It’s a time filled with both exhilarating potential and substantial challenges. Notably, while some argue that progress inevitably causes collateral damage, I believe that assumption reflects a lack of imagination. We must recognize that although jobs may be displaced, new opportunities and fields will emerge. However, the transition requires thoughtful upskilling and robust social safety nets. Progress doesn’t need to repeat the errors of the past; we have the capacity to organize and uplift entire communities through deliberate and inclusive actions.
The reverse narrative held by the self-identified “techno-altruists” that A.I. or any new technology will serve as a cure-all for societal issues is just as off-base. Realistically, many of our challenges, such as solving world hunger, don’t lack technological solutions but rather the political will to implement them. My optimism is cautious yet hopeful, and through this show, we aim to foster critical conversations about shaping a future where A.I. amplifies human potential rather than replaces it.
Why We Launched Creativity Squared
I recently returned from a Women in A.I. retreat hosted by Joanna Peña-Bickley, who was also our guest on Episode Four. One of the points she highlighted is the necessity of understanding and approaching the challenges that A.I. presents. For all artists and creators, my goal is to inform and empower you. Whether it’s protecting your intellectual property, enhancing your creative outputs with A.I., or choosing not to use A.I. at all, staying uninformed is a disservice to both oneself and society.
Creativity Squared is committed to empowering creators, artists, and the intellectually curious to navigate this new age of imagination confidently. As we transition from the information age, where productivity ruled, to an era where creativity and ideas reign supreme, A.I. offers unprecedented opportunities. It democratizes creativity, enabling those without traditional resources like camera or video equipment to bring their visions to life.
Each Thursday, I engage with trailblazers in A.I.—from artists to technologists—each sharing the belief that A.I. should enhance, not replace, human capabilities. My marketing background might have made it easier to focus solely on integrating A.I. into commercial strategies. However, the profound impact of this technology on our very humanity is too significant a topic to ignore. It challenges us to define what it means to be human and explore how technology can enhance our sense of community and connection.
Thank you for joining this journey. Every episode is a step towards a future that keeps humanity at the heart of technological advancement.
From Podcast to Platform: How Creativity Squared Started and Grew
In honor of the anniversary, I also wanted to share a bit about our origins and how the show has evolved into a platform. Back in 2010, I launched Sociality Squared, which was among the first social media agencies ever established. Being an early mover in that space showed me the profound impact of emerging technologies. Fast forward to October 2022, when a friend who works at OpenAI set off the chain of events that led us to this point by sharing a demo of ChatGPT-3 with me. I realized right then that his technology, reminiscent of the early days of social media, could and likely would transform all aspects of our lives by unleashing our creativity.
I was nurturing an idea for a miniseries for a long time before encountering ChatGPT. In fact, that was the very first use case I posed to ChatGPT. My plan initially was to develop the miniseries with A.I. over the course of about two years, and maybe I will in the down the line!
Our focus extends beyond leveraging A.I. for creativity; it’s about enhancing human connections and community through technology. I often reflect on Eric Solomon’s emphasis on the importance of human connections, especially now. We strive to support artists and foster a community where A.I. uplifts creativity, not overshadows it.
“I approach A.I. with a lot of healthy skepticism. What really matters at this time, more than ever, is doubling down on true human connection and knowing the difference between that and human and machine interaction.” – Eric Solomon, episode 8
A testament to our commitment is our partnership with ArtsWave, a leading arts nonprofit. Last year, we donated 10% of all revenue to support their Black and Brown artists program. This initiative funds artists who explore themes like truth, healing, and innovation through art. We’ve also featured these artists in a special podcast series to give them a larger platform to share their work.
On a personal note, my relocation to Cincinnati during the pandemic brought me closer to new opportunities in the A.I. space. Alongside Kendra Ramirez, I co-host Cincy AI, the region’s largest A.I. meetup. This gathering connects A.I. enthusiasts and professionals to foster innovation and community engagement.
In addition to organizing meetups, my involvement in the Cincinnati AI Catalyst aims to use A.I. to uplift the region’s diverse community. This includes workshops to empower underrepresented groups with A.I. literacy, focusing on privacy, cybersecurity, and media literacy.
Another initiative, our A.I. Readiness Assessments, helps local businesses integrate A.I. responsibly across their operations. Our inaugural client, the YMCA of Cincinnati, reflects our goal of using A.I. to reinforce community ties and improve organizational efficiency. We’re also building a referral network to connect businesses with bona fide A.I. experts.
Last but not least, my venture into ethical and consensual digital cloning with our partner, Render, has introduced new possibilities for personal and professional representation in digital spaces. Our website has more info about getting your own digital clone (which supports the show!).
My clone, Helen 2.ODD, speaks 28 languages (27 more than human Helen can speak) and represents a step towards the future of virtual human interaction. Natalie Monbiot, who leads strategy at the digital cloning firm Hour One, discussed in episode 39 how digital clones can open up opportunities by making your likeness available on a screen at any time or place, regardless of where your body is or what you’re doing.
“There are things I can now do, thanks to my virtual self, that I could not have even dreamed of doing before. So even though we’re still nascent in this virtual human economy, I think it really will become an economy at large and something that will affect all of us.” – Natalie Monbiot
Creativity Squared is more than just a podcast; it’s a platform for exploring how A.I. can be a force for good, enhancing our creative expressions, strengthening our communities, and fostering a deeper connection to the arts. As we move forward, I’m enthusiastic about the potential of A.I. to enrich our lives, and I invite you to join us on this journey.
Standout Conversations on Creativity Squared
When I talk about Creativity Squared out in the wild, I’m often asked about my biggest takeaways. It’s hard to narrow down just a few because I learn something new with each episode, or even while revisiting an episode.
That said, I have installed a few special guests on my imaginary “personal advisory board,” guests whose insights I use as a frame of reference in my own thinking and decision-making.
One such guest is Sara Horowitz, founder of the Freelancers Union, who focuses on building networks based on mutualism. In Episode 15, she shared insights from her family’s history in the labor movement, emphasizing the power of collective action even against the biggest adversaries. Just as laborers organized during the Industrial Revolution to fight crony capitalism, Sara suggests that mutualism can serve as a framework to combat corporate A.I. developers’ reckless determinism.
“What’s really important in this moment is to say, ‘is this technology mutualistic? Are we building this ourselves? And are we building this for what we need?’ Or are we being presented on a platter, what this new technology will look like, and then we are being told how we have to fit ourselves into it?” – Sara Horowitz
Another enlightening discussion was Episode 45 with Dr. Andrew Cullison, who advocates for the integration of moral reasoning in A.I. development. He highlighted the necessity of embedding ethical considerations directly into the A.I. development process to preemptively address potential issues.
“We need more people in our society trained to be able to identify moral issues because the real problems for A.I. are going to happen in spaces where there’s only a handful of people or a single research team. And that’s where the moral problem needs to be nipped in the bud right away. And so we need massive amounts of moral reasoning development across all areas of our population.”
One of our most impactful guests was Joanna Peña-Bickley, an inventor and design technologist who emphasized the need to conjure positive visions of A.I.’s future amid a sea of dystopian narratives in pop culture. It’s a theme that’s come up many times in subsequent interviews, but Joanna (a member of Fortune’s Most Powerful Women) is doing more than talking about it.
“I am personally funding stories about positive outcomes [with A.I.]. Because if we only have dystopian outcomes, we won’t get to the positive outcomes. We’re getting closer and closer to figuring out how we treat cancer and Alzheimer’s. How do we think about real human conditions where A.I. is actually improving people’s lives? If we continue to tell dystopian stories, we will not get to solve for the important things around climate, our health, our society.”
One of our guiding principles on the show is diversity in everything. While A.I. development in Europe is still catching up to American firms, Europeans’ contributions to A.I.-collaborative art can’t be overstated. In Episode 11, Gerfried Stocker, the head of programming at Ars Electronica, Europe’s premier art, tech, and society conference, emphasized the need for inclusivity in A.I. regulation. Gerfried pointed out the Western-centric nature of current discourse, advocating for a truly global conversation that includes diverse voices from around the world. This theme of inclusivity has resonated throughout several episodes of the show.
“ I think what we have to learn is there is no totality, there is no absolute truth. There is diversity, there’s ambiguity. How do we deal with this huge amount of ambiguity in our world? This is where, for me, the role of artists and art really come into the picture.”
These conversations and all the others I couldn’t fit on here always remind me of the ripple effects that thoughtful dialogue can create, transforming into waves of change. Each interview begins with setting a clear intention with our guests to foster positive discourse in this complex landscape.
In an upcoming episode, we will hear from Yemi, an artist selected for an extraordinary space journey with seven other creatives. At the Texas Eclipse Festival, Yemi shared a powerful message about the role of dreams in shaping our future: “What is our future made up of if not woven from the threads of our individual dreams? If we don’t create space and time for dreaming, if we are not courageous enough to share these dreams, then we can never evolve the tapestry of the future that we all aspire to weave.”
Reflecting on the power of dreams and their impact on art, I’m reminded of one of our most recent interviews with Martin Pagh, who built a chatbot trained on the writings and iconic voice of Salvador Dalí. I asked the chatbot, “Ask Dalí,” what will happen to human creativity as A.I. evolves?
I’d like to leave you with his response, which might be my favorite quote from any episode, partly because of Dalí’s penchant for speaking rich visual imagery but also because that imagery so beautifully captures our hopes for the future of human-A.I. collaboration.
“To blend the icy veins of artificial intelligence with the molten gold of human creativity is to perform alchemy of the highest order. We must coax the machines to dance in the moonlight of imagination, letting their circuits overflow with the unpredictable rivers of human thought, for the chaos of dreams and the precision of algorithms, the law is a masterpiece waiting to be born, a digital phoenix, ready to soar from the ashes of rigidity into the boundless sky of possibility.” – Ask Dalí chatbot
Links Mentioned in this Podcast
- Freelancers Union
- Helen 2.ODD
- Render
- Cincinnati AI Catalyst
- Cincy AI
- Sociality Squared
- MIT A.I. summit
- The AI Dilemma
- Play Audio Agency
- ArtsWave podcast series
- Creativity Squared Episode 1
- Creativity Squared Episode 4
- Creativity Squared Episode 8
- Creativity Squared Episode 11
- Creativity Squared Episode 15
- Creativity Squared Episode 39
- Creativity Squared Episode 45
- Ars Electronica
Continue the Conversation
Thank you for joining us on this special episode of Creativity Squared.
This show is produced and made possible by the team at PLAY Audio Agency: https://playaudioagency.com.
Creativity Squared is brought to you by Sociality Squared, a social media agency who understands the magic of bringing people together around what they value and love: http://socialitysquared.com.
Because it’s important to support artists, 10% of all revenue Creativity Squared generates will go to ArtsWave, a nationally recognized non-profit that supports over 150 arts organizations, projects, and independent artists.
Join Creativity Squared’s free weekly newsletter and become a premium supporter here.
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TRANSCRIPT
Salvador Dali: [00:00:00] To blend the icy veins of artificial intelligence with the molten gold of human creativity is to perform alchemy of the highest order. We must coax the machines to dance in the moonlight of imagination, letting their circuits overflow with the unpredictable rivers of human thought. For in the chaos of dreams and the precision of algorithms there lies a masterpiece waiting to be born, a digital phoenix, ready to soar from the ashes of rigidity, into the boundless sky of possibility.
Helen: Welcome to Creativity Squared, the leading podcast at the intersection of creativity and AI. Whether this is your first episode, your second, or your 47th, I’m so excited that you’re here. This is a special episode because we’ve surpassed the one year anniversary of Creativity Squared.
Helen: Welcome to Creativity Squared. Discover how creatives are collaborating with artificial intelligence in your inbox, on YouTube, and on your preferred podcast platform. Hi, I’m Helen Todd, your host, and I’m so excited to have you join the weekly conversations I’m having with amazing pioneers in the space.
Helen: The intention of these conversations is to ignite our collective imagination at the intersection of AI and creativity to envision a world where artists thrive.
Helen: Last year, the show launched on April 20th, 2023 with Harry Yeff. Also known as Reeps One. It’s been an exciting and fast paced year, both on the production side here at Creativity Squared. It’s often felt like we’re building the plane as we’re flying it. But also, as you know, with everything that has transpired with AI, it has been a roller coaster ride where we buckled up and it’s definitely not slowing down anytime soon.
Helen: And I want to say a massive thank you to everyone who has believed in me and this project and has supported me, whether through text messages and encouraging words, listening and subscribing, becoming, or signing up for the newsletter, becoming a paid member, whether premium or founding member, it really means the world to me and helps fuel me and keep me going with the podcast.
Helen: And also I have to do a massive shout out to all of the humans behind me. It takes a village and it takes a team here at Creativity Squared. Much love to Edward, Dan and Megan, and also to Play Audio Agency who produces the show and makes creativity squared possible. When I launched the show last year it was kind of fast and furious, but it was shortly after SXSW 2023 and Greg Brockman got on stage.
Helen: Who’s the co-founder of Open AI that makes Chat GPT. And on the interview, the gal who was doing the fireside chat, kind of pushed him on some of the more moral and ethical questions about like artist attribution, and he said on stage, “You know, that’s a really good question. We don’t have the hubris to have all of the answers. All of society needs to weigh in on how we want these tools to be used.”
Helen: And that was really a light bulb moment for me for a couple of different reasons. One, the creators of these tools, which are impacting society and all facets of our lives, don’t have all the answers at all. And they don’t even know the functionality and of the tools that they’re building either.
Helen: But also how important it is right now to have conversations about these tools and conversations and community to really envision how we want our future to be and have it to be a human centered future where AI amplifies the best of human potential and not replace it. And literally the founders of these tools are opening up that conversation and that we need to have these.
Helen: So, you know, that really stuck with me. And one of the intentions of this show is to be a proactive voice for a human centered future with AI. To envision a world where artists not only coexist with AI, but thrive. And I say artists and the show definitely explores the intersection of AI and creativity, but it’s for artists, creators, curious minds, anyone really interested in the intersection of AI and creativity.
Helen: And even though we surpassed one year, we’re still just getting started. And I’m also a really big believer that you never know what ripples will turn into waves and how one conversation could really make a really big difference. And I also want to say my commitment to you, dear listener and watcher, I so, so appreciate you.
Helen: I know in this fast paced, crazy world, time is our most valuable resource. And I appreciate everyone who spent a little bit of time with me listening to these episodes. And my commitment to you is that I will work my hardest to make this time well spent and add value and keep asking the questions needed to navigate this new future together.
Helen: And this new future that we’re all navigating together. I know that it can be scary. The unknown can be scary. Change can be scary, as part of our human nature. And there’s a lot of incredibly valid concerns about AI. I share a lot of these concerns and I want to have this show be a safe space to explore these, whether you’re nervous and just dipping your toes into AI or, you know, already drinking the Kool Aid in a lot of ways.
Helen: But one thing is for sure, AI is here. The Pandora’s box has been opened and prior to Chat GPT’s massive success, you know, AI is already embedded into all of our lives and all of our technology, whether that’s Google search results, the algorithms powering the social networks, Siri, Google maps, like AI is already here.
Helen: The big difference when Open AI launched Chat GPT, is that it made it accessible with generative AI for the everyday person, because we’re interacting with AI through natural language. And it’s just, you know, as everyone knows has exploded and [it’s] not slowing down. And actually the night before I launched the podcast, so that had been April 19th, I was watching a presentation by Tristan Harris and Aza Raskin, who are the co-founders for the Center for Humane Technology.
Helen: They’re the same group who did the documentary on Netflix called The Social Dilemma. And it was an extremely sobering presentation, which I highly recommend. If you haven’t seen [it,] it’s on YouTube, it’s on the Creativity Squared blog as well. I actually, I liked the framing. They’re like [as] picturesque as people from the future coming back in time to give you the warning of what we need to do now in terms of slowing down the production.
Helen: Didn’t really happen. Getting the regulation. We’re kind of seeing that a little bit, but also just in general, not making the same mistakes that we did with social media that we are now seeing, you know, a decade later, how polarizing it is, the loneliness epidemic, depression among teens and whatnot. And the implications with AI can even be larger and more exacerbated.
Helen: So I fully acknowledge and understand a lot of the concerns. And actually one, one interview, you know, this is the 47th episode. I’ve got to interview so many amazing people and I learned so much that the show partly is like me learning everything I can about AI and bringing you along with me.
Helen: And so many people, what they’ve said has stuck with me, as both inspirations, little aha moments, learnings that have shaped my thinking. And one really poignant thing that Thomas Boenig, who’s an amazing photographer said, we’ll just roll the clip.
Thomas Boenig: It’s what kept me alive for sure. All of these years have kept me in the job was, you know, the people and all the effort that goes into creating photography.
Thomas Boenig: I’d hate to see the craft slowly fade away and be replaced by computers, but it will have so many positive impacts on our lives that’s also the question if maybe we can sacrifice photography for the sake of humanity being able to cure cancer. I’m totally fine with that. If that’s the result, I think the only important thing is we have to be very realistic about AI right now, being the reflection of human achievement.
Helen: But I thought it was so poignant. He was really worried and still is about the impact of AI on photography. And when he said, you know, but if AI can cure cancer, then I could be okay with losing photography. And that’s really just stuck with me. Within the lane of AI and creativity, there’s a lot of specific concerns too with deep fakes, with copyrights and attribution that we all need to work out and with the intentionality to support humans and pick people over profits.
Helen: But one thing, hearing Thomas say that AI, despite the fears and all of the concerns, we are sitting on the [00:10:06] precipice of so much human progress and outside of the lanes of AI and creativity, it’s hard for us to actually imagine what’s on the horizon because it’s happening so fast.
Helen: And there’s this seismic history-making moment that we’re all living through right now, like a couple of examples off hand is Google’s AI lab, DeepMind, and we did have the head of DeepMind’s comms, Dex Barton on the show [on] which he actually said something really lovely, which we’ll roll that clip.
Dex Barton: Things that may seem science fiction right now are coming and they are going to have a huge impact on the way that billions of people live their lives. And that is just [an] incontrovertible fact from my point of view. So we need to take this stuff seriously. We need to understand the consequences because there will be things that are very, very good.
Dex Barton: And there will be things that are very, very challenging. And we need to understand both if we want to make the most of it.
Helen: So AI really does have the potential to impact the billions of people on this planet in amazing ways. Like, for one example, Google’s DeepMind has already like uncovered structures for 200 million proteins from, you know, a medical and scientific sense.
Helen: This could have a huge impact on global problems such as famine and disease. The same lab has already discovered like 2.2 million new crystals for new material development, which has the potential to develop greener technologies from batteries for electric cars to superconductors for more efficient computing.
Helen: Here in Cincinnati, Dr. Kelly Cohen, who’s a good friend and colleague, co-founded a company called Genexia Health that uses AI to diagnose coronary artery disease risk during a woman’s mammogram, because not enough women get these exams and understand the risk in time. So he’s using AI to help solve a coronary artery disease, which is amazing.
Helen: I have been on a massive conference spree this year, soaking up and meeting people to bring onto the show and soaking up as much information to come back and share with you all. And one of the conferences I recently went to was the MIT AI Summit at the MIT Media Lab, and really the practitioners and the who’s who of people building AI were all on stage.
Helen: And it was a really phenomenal jam packed day. And one of the gentlemen who’s the general partner at Flagship Venture, they’re using AI to give, to understand more of the rules of DNA to encode function to devices around proteins. But basically as I understood it or understand it is that, instead of pharmaceuticals, which are kind of, you know, a stab in the dark, if they’re going to work or not, AI is helping us unlock the ability at a molecular level to solve diseases in ways that we haven’t been able to before.
Helen: It really is exciting with all of these scientific breakthroughs, the precipice of the progress that we’re sitting on right now, and what’s to come. I’m also hyper aware of a couple other things, the narrative fallacy. Traditionally, you know, I hear some people saying that progress inevitably has collateral damage.
Helen: And you know, I think that’s a lack of imagination. I think, you know, jobs will be displaced and there will be tons of amazing new jobs and fields created, but there is going to be this gap of needing of upscaling and social safety net and that type of thing. But we don’t have to repeat the same stories of the past that all progress just has collateral damage.
Helen: We can organize and make sure to bring everyone along with us and have AI uplift the entire community. And that’s not a technology problem. That’s a people problem and a political will problem. And I’m also hyper aware that some of these techno altruists, one of the criticisms is that AI or any technology, what we don’t have the answers for, AI will solve and I don’t really subscribe to that.
Helen: You know, AI will help us in ways that we fully don’t understand or can imagine today in the seats that we sit. But at the end of the day, A lot of the problems that we’re facing, and there’s a lot happening in the world right now, can be solved without technology. It’s not a matter of technology. It’s a matter of will and political will.
Helen: I’m cautiously optimistic and the show is here to help have the important conversations to really define and get clear on what is the future that we want to envision for ourselves and live in where AI amplifies the best of human potential and not replace it. I mentioned earlier, you know, my intentions with the show and one of the other conferences that I just got back from was a Women in AI retreat hosted by Joanna Peña-Bickley, who is the guest for episode four on the show.
Helen: And one of the things too, you know, I’ve talked about like, AI being scary. And when I talk to people, I’ll talk to anyone like on the airplane or who I meet, and I get a lot of, you know, varied reactions about, you know, from being totally scared and head in the sand when it comes to AI to totally embracing it.
Helen: But one of the things that was said at this retreat is if we’re going to build the future that we want, we need to know what’s coming. And if we want to solve problems, we need to get close to what that problem is. So for any of the artists and creators out there, like, I don’t want you to get hit by a Mack truck of everything that’s coming with AI.
Helen: I want you to be informed. I want you to be empowered to have agency, whether that’s to protect your IP, to accelerate your creative output using AI or not to use AI, but keeping your head in the sand with what’s coming isn’t going to serve anyone. And if we’re going to help shape a human centered future, we need to know what’s coming.
Helen: That’s one of the main reasons for this show too, so that I’m asking the questions. I want to know what your questions are so that we all understand what’s coming and how to navigate it and retain agency of how we want to use these tools at the end of the day. So the show is dedicated to empowering creators, artists, and curious minds to unlock exponential creativity and confidently navigate AI in this new imagination age.
Helen: And I use imagination age. I actually got that from Claire Silver. After my interview with her, she tweeted a screenshot from Wikipedia about the imagination age and what this is, we’re leaving the information age. And instead of about productivity and what you can do, it’s all about our ideas and if you have great ideas and can communicate them, you can bring them to life through AI, which is really exciting.
Helen: And you know, it’s so exciting that the democratization of creativity, people who might not have access to equipment like camera equipment, video equipment, as long as they have the idea and access to the tools, can now start creating art, and we’re going to see so many new voices and so many new ideas that gets me really excited.
Helen: For those who’ve been listening, you know, that every Thursday I interview trailblazers in AI from the artists like Thomas, who are concerned about it to the artists like Chad Nelson and Claire Silver, who literally, their career trajectories have changed because of AI to the ethicists like Andrew Cullison, to those who are building the tech on the show.
Helen: And, we all have a common thread of, we understand that AI is a tool to amplify the best of human potential and not replace it. And in some ways, you know, why am I honing in on this? My background is a marketer and I could have done AI in marketing.
Helen: And in some ways it would have been easier and less controversial of, you know, just how to use commercially safe gen-AI image and video tools and you know, work it into your marketing workflows, which we are doing, and I am doing some consulting on for other agencies, but you know, this is such a seismic moment that we’re sitting and this technology is really a reflection of us and our humanity. And it’s really challenging or begging the question of what it means to be human.
Helen: And creativity, fundamentally, is part of what makes us human. And, you know, that’s a question that I’m fascinated by [at] this moment of time. What truly makes us human, because we need to safeguard that and protect it. And how can this technology, you know, help us become better humans, help us be in community with one another and help us connect together.
Helen: And that’s a question that I’m really excited about more so than marketing, even though I love marketing and that I’m exploring on this show and just, you know, being, as I’ve said, a champion for a future that keeps humans at the center of this technology. And I know I’ve talked a lot about the intention of the show and mentioned a few guests.
Helen: But if you are new to Creativity Squared, this is the one year anniversary. I’ll give you a little bit more of the backstory too of how we got started. So I launched Sociality Squared, which is my social media agency back in 2010, we were one of the first dozen ever social media agencies to ever exist.
Helen: So it was very early on seeing just the impact of social media. And then in October of 2022, a friend of mine who works at Open AI, gave me a demo of, I think it was Chat GPT 3. And I always have creative thought projects that entertain me and whatnot. And one of them is this little mini series I’ve been working on for a couple of years.
Helen: And we put in the opening scene into, what is it? His dogfooding version. And within seconds, the action and dialogue and everything about the scene just came out and it really, you know, captured my imagination. And as we know, in the following month, after it was released, it captured the world’s imagination and became the fastest adopted app of all time.
Helen: And it felt like social media all over again of this big, disruptive technology that’s going to impact all facets of our lives for better or for worse. And I think I had one thought at one point in time, like, Oh, maybe I’ll give myself two years and do the first mini series, totally collaborating with AI.
Helen: That didn’t happen. I launched this podcast instead. And with the text to video that technology probably will be able to happen this year. But who knows, maybe I’ll get around to doing my mini series too. I’ll keep you posted. But yeah, so, I mean, this big disruptive technology for better or for worse.
Helen: You know, I love social media. It has a slew of problems, but what I love most about it or when it’s at its best is connecting people together around what they value and love and reinforcing our offline relationships. So I’m excited to explore how AI can help us become better humans and artists and reinforce our relationships and being in community with one another, which is so important.
Helen: I’m actually reminded of this quote from Eric Solomon, who really reinforces the need for human to human connection. Right now, in this moment in time.
Eric Solomon: I know there’s a lot of potential, but we’re not great at looking at the potential of technology and making the most of it. And all you have to look at is across our social media platforms to know that that is true.
Eric Solomon: So I don’t know, I approach it with a lot of skepticism and healthy skepticism that what really matters in this time more than ever is doubling down a true human connection and knowing the difference between that and human and machine interaction.
Helen: And one thing I’ve also said too, is that I want to live in a world where artists not only coexist with AI, but thrive.
Helen: And I wanted to be super, super clear from the outset of this show, that I support artists. My mother is an artist. I come from an entrepreneurial family. My dad, who’s passed, was a tinkerer and made crafts and inventions. My stepdad at one point had a pewter gallery where he spun pewter on a lathe. I always have creative projects.
Helen: I work with creatives through Sociality Squared and this podcast. My niece, Lucy is an amazing little maker and artist. So I wanted to be super, super clear that I support artists. I love art, everything about art and expression. So from the outset, I have committed 10 percent of all revenue that Creativity Squared generates to go to Arts Wave, which is a nationally recognized nonprofit that supports over 150 arts organizations, projects, and independent artists.
Helen: And last year we did an amazing partnership, which we’re going to do this year too. And the funds are earmarked, I should say for the, for their black and brown artists program, which specifically gives grants to black and brown artists on different themes of like, truth and healing, truth and reconciliation.
Helen: This year’s theme is truth and innovation and using art to help bridge cultural divides. And here’s a clip from my interview with Janice, who’s the VP of Equitable Arts at ArtsWave.
Janice Liebenberg: My CEO, Alicia Kintner always says, “Show me a problem that there is not an art solution for.” And so, we believe first and foremost, that the arts is such a great unifier and bringing people together of all races, religion, you know, age groups.
Janice Liebenberg: And for us, you know, bridging cultural divides through the arts is actually a puller.
Helen: And the project that we did last year is we interviewed all of last year’s grant recipients. We did a special three part podcast series, and we have, I think, 17 longer, 15 minute or so video interviews of each artist, giving them a larger platform of their amazing messages.
Helen: And if you haven’t seen that series, I really encourage you to watch it. And I’m so excited to see all of the winners. There’s 22 grant winners this year and how they’re going to interpret the theme of truth and innovation and all the mediums that they’ll be using. By listening to this show, you know, you’re supporting Creativity Squared.
Helen: I do encourage you, if you can, to consider tipping or becoming a premium or founding member, you can do that at CreativitySquared.com and 10 percent of all revenue goes to ArtsWave. So you’ll be supporting the show to help make Creativity Squared possible and directly supporting ArtsWave black and brown artists program.
Helen: Elevating underrepresented voices and bridging cultural divides through art. If you listen to the show, I fangirl out very easily about my guests and artists and programs. And I am definitely a fangirl of ArtsWave and their approach to really uplifting here in Cincinnati, the Cincinnati region through art.
Helen: Since I mentioned ArtsWave, I’m headquartered here in Cincinnati, Ohio. This was a bit of a pandemic move in 2020. I was based in New York City for 11 years. I relocated to Cincinnati in August of 2020. And I’m so glad that I came back here. I did my undergrad at Xavier university. My brother and his family are setting, are putting down their roots here in Cincinnati.
Helen: And I’m so glad that I’m here in this moment in time. Cincinnati has been good to me, but I also kind of wanted to tell you a few other things outside of the show of what’s happening here in Cincinnati as well, too. In addition to Creativity Squared, which we’re exploring, you know, the intersection of AI and creativity for all the reasons that I just shared.
Helen: I really am very motivated and feel passionate about using AI to uplift as many people as possible. And there’s a few concrete ways here in Cincinnati, how that’s coming to life. So one of the ways is through Cincy AI. It’s the largest meetup in the region. A friend connected me to my co-host Kendra Ramirez, I think last September.
Helen: And she shares that, you know, everyone was coming to her to get help with AI. And she’s like, “You need to meet so, you need to meet so and so.” And there’s all of this amazing AI talent. And she just wanted to bring everyone together in one place so that everyone can kind of connect and connect all the dots.
Helen: So we hopped on the phone. I was like, “Do you need help? I’d love to be a part of this.” And she said, “Absolutely.” And then I think the following month we launched our first meetup. So that was October of 2023. And we’ve been having them monthly ever since. And these get over like 150 people coming together.
Helen: We’ve had some folks come from Indianapolis, Cleveland, which is a four or five hour drive to attend one of our meetups and everyone who comes is from the AI curious to AI users, to AI builders and academics. I mentioned Dr. Kelly Cohen earlier. He’s our organizing partner. He’s an AI researcher at the University of Cincinnati.
Helen: He is one of the leading thought leaders on responsible AI. He wrote the textbook on fuzzy logic, which plays a big part of this. And we are able to host Cincy AI at the UC Digital Futures building and in partnership with the University of Cincinnati, which we are so grateful for. And the Digital Futures building is a hundred million dollar investment for a multidisciplinary building here in Cincinnati.
Helen: And one thing I found, people in Cincinnati don’t even know all the time what’s going on here on the tech front, which we are actively trying to change that. But they have everything from a drone lab, a biotech lab, an extended realities lab and everything under one roof. And I think one thing that is really special about the University of Cincinnati, say, compared to MIT is because the school is so large.
Helen: You have the humanities, mixed into the education of your future engineers, which we need the humanities so much right now. And so I’m super proud about Cincy AI, we’re doing our monthly meetups here in Cincinnati, bringing the community together. Educating, learning, sharing what’s happening.
Helen: And I’m always blown away about the amazing talent and what’s happening right here in our backyard in Cincinnati. I mentioned Dr. Kelly Cohen’s company earlier. You also have Naratize, which is three co-founders who are all female, who are using narrative science, Katie has been on the show and a ton of other amazing companies.
Helen: And really the mission of Cincy AI is that the tide rises all ships, and we’re an important community node in the AI ecosystem here in Cincinnati. Because of my involvement with Cincy AI, I also got invited to be part of the Cincinnati AI Catalyst, which is a consortium tasked with using AI from different disciplines to uplift the region’s 2.25 million residents through outcome driven projects.
Helen: And I’m super excited about this group. We’re looking at everything from education to workforce development and whatnot. And a gentleman, because of my involvement in that, reached out to me. Who’s very, or he knew a gentleman who is very involved with the Guatemalan immigrant community here in Cincinnati.
Helen: And someone had reached out to him saying like, they want to know how to protect themselves from AI and how to leverage AI, you know, for their small businesses. Whether that’s lawn care or something else. We’ve put together a mini cohort with Alejandro, who was also a guest on the show, who’s a human centered researcher at the UC Digital Futures building, along with John Kavanaugh, who runs the Plunk Foundation.
Helen: And we’re putting together a mini workshop series to empower this community to learn about some of the basics like data privacy, cyber security, media literacy, and also AI literacy. So really from a grassroots level, helping uplift this community and the way that we’re designing the program and also applying for some grants to help offset the cost is to use the initial workshop series as a pilot and then being able to train and scale the program for all of the immigrant communities underrepresented, traditionally underrepresented and underserved communities here in Cincinnati, and even potentially, you know, labor unions and whatnot.
Helen: So I’m really excited and proud about this project of really taking the concepts of you know, how we can use AI to uplift everyone and putting them in the hands of people who could really use it the most. And also because of all of my jumping into the deep end of all things, AI, people started coming to me for AI consulting and whatnot.
Helen: I’ve said many times, I’m not an AI expert, even though people are starting to say, Helen, you know 5 percent more than most people or 10 percent more than most people. So you’re an AI expert when it comes to some of like the really technical things about data architecture and that type of thing. I am definitely not an AI expert, but I am building now, a referral program here in Cincinnati with some amazing local businesses that really do have the AI expertise.
Helen: I’m so proud to work with them here in Cincinnati, and we’re doing AI readiness assessments to determine how, yeah, AI ready your company is to really integrate AI, not just through a marketing lens, but through every aspect of your company. And that looks at, you know, the people, the processes, the governance and the technology and our first client is with the YMCA of Cincinnati.
Helen: I’m so excited. I’ve been a member of the YMCA for many years, and I couldn’t think of a better client to work with on using AI for a human centered future, to reinforce the community hubs that they have, define efficiencies because their, you know, staff is overloaded as is, to help ease that and help bring people together.
Helen: So very excited about YMCA as a project. And if you’re interested in these AI readiness assessments, reach out to me. We can hop on the phone and I can connect you with the right partner. The other thing [is] that if you’ve been listening to the show, you know, that I’ve also digitally cloned myself. I’m the first resident of Cincinnati to have a hyper realistic avatar.
Helen: I’ve named her, quote unquote, Helen 2.ODD. My, you know, my name is Helen Todd. And there’s not ever going to be a Helen 2.0, that’s better than the original. So I named her Helen 2.ODD. And we’re still at the very early days of cloning and we’ve done many episodes with Render, who made my clone and some other people in the industry to talk about the future of the human virtual economy and whatnot.
Helen: And actually here’s a really great clip from Natalie on it.
Natalie Monbiot: Wow. So there are things I can now do thanks to my virtual self that I could not have even dreamed of doing before. And so, even though we’re still nascent in this virtual human economy, I think it really will become an economy at large and something that will affect all of us.
Helen: Since I’ve digitally cloned myself and in partnership with Render, we have a partner studio here. So if you’re interested in getting cloned, reach out. And if you’re not based in the Cincinnati area, Render has a network of partners across our partner studios across the United States, and we can get you cloned so that you can put your clone to work, whether to streamline video production or have language superpowers.
Helen: I speak only one language and my clone speaks 28 languages, you know, feel free to reach out. A lot to cover on our one year anniversary. Since I watched the show and I tell people about the show, I often get, “What are your biggest learnings related to AI and creativity.” I listen to each episode so many times.
Helen: I prep for the interviews. I conduct the interview. And then there’s an editing process, both from the audio version and the video version. So I’m listening to it from an editing sense. And even sometimes after they’re edited, I’ll listen to it just as a… consuming the content and some of the episodes I’ll go back and listen to.
Helen: And I learned something new all the time from these shows so they really are near and dear to me and I’ve [gotten] so much out of them, but from a high level, a few that really have stuck in my head, little nuggets that the seed has been planted and, you know, I don’t know if you’ve heard of this concept of your personal advisory board, and it can be like an imaginary thing where, you know, maybe it’s a mentor or someone you really look up to, and you’re trying to, you know, navigate a question, you know, what would your advisory board [do]?
Helen: I feel like a lot of the guests on my show have become my advisory board. And maybe for you too. One seed that was planted was from Sarah Horowitz, who I had the amazing opportunity to work with her, through Sociality Squared. And she was so gracious to come on the show. She’s the founder of the freelancers union in New York City and currently is working on building mutualistic networks and everything mutualism is her jam.
Helen: Definitely encourage you to listen to that episode if you haven’t already. But one of the questions I asked her and her family comes from really the initial labor union movements in New York City and the garment district. So she really understands labor movements and people coming together and organizing.
Helen: And when I said earlier on the show, you know, I want everyone to have agency and to help envision this future. I totally understand how overwhelming it can be when you’re going up against billion dollar companies like Google and Microsoft and like, how can we really make a big difference? Like I feel that and I asked her this question and her answer, we’ll just roll the clip.
Sarah Horowitz: But I am not going to underestimate the power of decentralization and coordination and integration and cooperation.
Helen: So never underestimate people coming together because that’s, and there’s another quote by someone else, Margaret Mead maybe, that’s the only thing that has really ever changed history.
Helen: So if you’re ever feeling overwhelmed about the enormity of this tech and the major companies and players in the space that, you know, don’t ever underestimate people coming together. So, that’s one big nugget that has stuck with me. And also a more recent episode with Dr. Andrew Cullison or Andy, you know, we talk about responsible AI, ethical AI, and these are a lot of, in some sense, buzzwords that are overused.
Helen: He’s a leading academic in mind when it comes to moral reasoning; that show is really good. I feel like all of my shows are like my children and I brag about all of them. But one of the big takeaways for that is, we need everyone trained on moral reasoning. We need more ethicists in the room, but why we need like, especially the builders, is that they need to be trained on moral reasoning because the ethicists can’t be in the room where everyone is at all the time.
Helen: And to spot the problems earlier on, we could do a better job if everyone had moral reasoning [skills]. So very big, he got me to be now a very big advocate for moral reasoning. So I definitely encourage you to listen to that episode and get curious about how you can integrate moral reasoning or learn about it.
Helen: And that show, he shared a few different frameworks for just everyday problems. But if you’re a company that is [00:40:23] building AI tools to consider integrating moral reasoning, learnings and professional development into your company and personal development programs or professional development programs.
Helen: Joanna Peña Bickley, who’s amazing. I just got back from her design lab in Newburgh, New York, where it was AI, really women in AI supporting each other, which is always very beautiful. But I remember in the interview with her, which was episode four, I kind of pushed her on some of the more, you know, some more of the concerns and stuff.
Helen: And she really pushed back that we need a vision and more positive stories. And this has been a theme that’s come up many times in different episodes is that there’s so many dystopian stories out there with AI that we really need a vision for where we’re going and what that looks like.
Helen: Utopia might not be the right word, but we need positive stories and to give us the permission to dream of what might be possible. And as I said earlier, you know, understand the problem, get close to it, mitigate the concerns as much as possible because there are a lot bias, deep fakes, and it goes on and on, but that we need the positive stories and the vision of where we’re going to.
Helen: Another bug that was planted comes from Gerfried Stocker, who’s the head of programming at Ars Electronica, which, if you aren’t familiar with Ars Electronica, it’s the largest art, tech, and society conference in Europe. That’s really phenomenal. I had the chance to go one day last year.
Helen: But we were talking about regulation, and one thing that he really surfaced is, you know, it’s such a Western thing to say we have all the answers or that we need to come up with all the answers for the rest of the world. And we live in such an interconnected global society that if we want AI to uplift everyone, we need all voices from all parts of the world to be part of the conversation and not just have it be a Western led conversation.
Helen: And that has come up a lot of different times on the show too. And when I was on stage with Professor Dakai, who will be a guest eventually on the show, you know, that came up too and he actually worked on many of the resolutions like the UN resolution for AI, and he had pointed out that, for this, you know, global framework, ethical framework, that only a few people outside of the Western world contributed to it, he pointed it out, and they improved it, but there’s definitely more work to be done there to make sure that all voices are part of the conversation as well.
Helen: So those were a couple of my takeaways. I’m cautiously optimistic. I’m here because I feel like I can make a difference. And like I said earlier, you never know what ripples will turn into waves. And before every interview, I always set an intention with the guest of what we want to, yeah, just the intention behind the conversations, because I want to be a positive voice in this landscape.
Helen: And Yemi, this is a nice teaser for an upcoming guest. He is an amazing artist who got selected to go around the moon with seven other artists. And I want to actually read something that he had said on stage at the Texas Eclipse Festival. “What is our future made up of? If not woven from the threads of our individual dreams, if we don’t create space and time for dreaming, if we are not courageous enough to share the dreams with each other, then we can never evolve this tapestry of the future that we want to dream about. And the space journey that we’re getting ready for is definitely an important dream.”
Helen: Thank you for spending some time with us today. We’re just getting started and would love your support. Subscribe to Creativity Squared on your preferred podcast platform and leave a review. It really helps. And I’d love to hear your feedback.
Helen: What topics are you thinking about and want to dive into more? I invite you to visit CreativitySquared.com to let me know. And while you’re there, be sure to sign up for our free weekly newsletter so you can easily stay on top of all the latest news at the intersection of AI and creativity. Because it’s so important to support artists, 10 percent of all revenue Creativity Squared generates will go to ArtsWave, a nationally recognized nonprofit that supports over 100 arts organizations.
Helen: Become a premium newsletter subscriber or leave a tip on the website to support this project and ArtsWave. And premium newsletters subscribers will receive NFTs of episode cover art and more extras to say thank you for helping bring my dream to life. And a big, big thank you to everyone who’s offered their time, energy, and encouragement and support so far.
Helen: I really appreciate it from the bottom of my heart. This show is produced and made possible by the team at Play Audio Agency. Until next week, keep creating.